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  • Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

    1. In 14:29 KJV, which wording is most correct:
    • Peter walked upon the water and came (??? ?????) to Jesus?
    • Peter walked upon the water to come (??????) to Jesus?

    2. In 14:30 KJV, is the adjective "boisterous" (???????) necessary to the story?

    3. Why does the story of Peter walking on water appear only in the Matthew Gospel?

  • #2
    Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

    Originally posted by Heterodoxus
    1. In 14:29 KJV, which wording is most correct:
    • Peter walked upon the water and came (??? ?????) to Jesus?
    • Peter walked upon the water to come (??????) to Jesus?
    I'm not a Greek scholar so you may be way over my head. As I meditate in the difference, quite frankly I don't see where 'to come' or 'and came' makes any difference in the understanding.

    2. In 14:30 KJV, is the adjective "boisterous" (???????) necessary to the story?
    I think so. The picture given by the word 'boisterous' does much to understand the principle laid therein and reinforces the histories of other example dealing with the same problem.

    The 'noise' in boisterous dictates how circumstances can be loud and distract one from what faith can accomplish. It also notes that it isn't only senses of the hearing but also in the seeing (saw the wind) that influences ones beliefs.

    The distraction caused him to sink.

    The refocusing on Jesus caused him to rise again into faith.

    3. Why does the story of Peter walking on water appear only in the Matthew Gospel?
    No way to answer that question. There are many stories that one gospel has and others don't. We do know that if they wrote everything that Jesus did and said, (analogy), there wouldn't be enough space to place all the books.

    John 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did , the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written KJV

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

      I like to think he froze the water first, and walked across the ice. (Ice is, still, technically, water, you know.)

      Or he knew where the rocks were....

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

        Originally posted by wmdkitty
        I like to think he froze the water first, and walked across the ice. (Ice is, still, technically, water, you know.)

        Or he knew where the rocks were....
        The "rocks" story is when there was a Charismatic Pastor, a Catholic Priest and a Jewish Rabbi.

        They were all fishing. The Pastor got tired of waiting, threw the rod on the boat and got out and walked on the water to the shore.

        The Rabbi's eyes went as wide as they could go. The Priest said "I agree" and threw his rod on the boat and walked on water to the shore.

        The Rabbi's eyes went wide as saucers.

        The Rabbi said, "Well, I am a representative of God too!" Got out of the boat and sank.

        He didn't know about the underwater rock wall.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

          The version I heard had a Wiccan priestess, a Jewish Rabbi, and an Evangelical preacher. The priestess and the rabbi walked across the water, and are standing on the shore.

          Evangelist, not to be shown up by "foul demon worshippers" tried the same, and sank.

          Rabbi turns to Priestess and asks, "Do you think we should have told him about the rocks?"

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

            Originally posted by wmdkitty
            The version I heard had a Wiccan priestess, a Jewish Rabbi, and an Evangelical preacher. The priestess and the rabbi walked across the water, and are standing on the shore.

            Evangelist, not to be shown up by "foul demon worshippers" tried the same, and sank.

            Rabbi turns to Priestess and asks, "Do you think we should have told him about the rocks?"
            LOL


            I guess each faith has its own version.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

              Why does the story of Peter walking on water appear only in the Matthew Gospel?
              Why does the Our Father prayer appear only in Matthews gospel? Why do the infancy narratives appear only in Luke's gospel? Why does the wedding feast at Cana appear only in John's gospel? We could go on and on and on. The short answer is this means there are at least four ways to tell the Jesus story. The long answer requires a lot of keystrokes dealing with how the writers of these books consolidated and edited and wrote their specific gospels. But there is absolutely nothing special about a particular gospel telling a particular story not in the other gospels. The Church knew when it canonized the four gospels they didn't all sync up exactly alike. We've known this since the late 1st century.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

                Thanks for your responses (you too, Deacon777 )

                Now a more difficult question:
                • from where, or from whom, did the Christian belief in levitation originate?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

                  Originally posted by Heterodoxus
                  Thanks for your responses (you too, Deacon777 )

                  Now a more difficult question:
                  • from where, or from whom, did the Christian belief in levitation originate?
                  ;D Your question is worded wrong. Christians believe in miracles not in levitation.

                  You could say that belief in miracles began with Moses and even before.

                  More specifically... faith begins when the knowledge of God is declared. When Jesus told Peter to come out... at that moment it became possible and only because it was declared to Peter at that moment, for that specific time and for a specific purpose.

                  If I were to take the Tannakh as an example, I would say that when Joshua crossed the river Jordan on and by command of God which caused the waters to recede from the city of Adam (representing the beginning as well as the beginning of sin) unto the Dead Sea (representing the results of sin) - it was for that moment, for that specific time, for a specific purpose on the command of God.

                  We don't believe in "parting waters" - we believe in God.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

                    Originally posted by Heterodoxus
                    Thanks for your responses (you too, Deacon777 )

                    Now a more difficult question:
                    • from where, or from whom, did the Christian belief in levitation originate?
                    Would that also include the Hebrew scriptures - like Elijah being taken up into heaven on a fiery chariot?

                    There are two issues at play here. One, the use of metaphor and allegory in storytelling to transmit a revealed truth the biblical writer wants to convey. Two, revelation is ultimately metaphysical.

                    That means, at least for Christians, why would we be skeptical about Peter walking on the water (ever so briefly with Christ), when we have believed for almost 2000 years that a man was killed and rose from the dead after three days - and ascended into heaven - levitating all the way one might presume?

                    What about raising Lazarus from the dead? Or the Mt. of Transfiguration experience? The virgin birth? Just to name a few. If one rules out any possibility of divine intervention into ordinary human life (including the Godman Jesus Christ) - then the Christian story cannot happen. It is just another one of Joseph Campbell's "The Power of Myth" examples, of which according to him, there are many.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

                      Originally posted by Deacon777
                      It is just another one of Joseph Campbell's "The Power of Myth" examples, of which according to him, there are many.
                      Great book! And I think it should be mandatory reading for everyone before they're allowed to post anything.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

                        Originally posted by Metis
                        Originally posted by Deacon777
                        It is just another one of Joseph Campbell's "The Power of Myth" examples, of which according to him, there are many.
                        Great book! And I think it should be mandatory reading for everyone before they're allowed to post anything.
                        I've read some of Campbell and watched his PBS interviews with Bill Moyers. He was very well compensated for his opinions and efforts to promote same.

                        Nevertheless, is a Bible event based on a traditional story accepted as history (myth; e.g., walking on water) consistent with fact or reality (true) just because people choose to believe it despite real world experiences to the contrary? Shouldn't faith-full Christians be navigating the world's waterways on foot and not in boats, ships, or on PWC?

                        Getting back to my question, I ask again: from where, or from whom, did the Christian belief in levitation* originate? Please, focus on the question and refrain from scripture-related circular reasoning or the offering of unsolicited personal beliefs/opinions?


                        * levitation: "To rise or cause to rise into the air and float in apparent defiance of gravity" (Answers.com); "The phenomenon of a person or thing rising into the air by apparently supernatural means" (WordWeb Dictionary); "The act of raising (a body) from the ground [or water] by presumably spiritualistic means" (op. cit.).

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

                          Originally posted by Heterodoxus
                          Originally posted by Metis
                          Originally posted by Deacon777
                          It is just another one of Joseph Campbell's "The Power of Myth" examples, of which according to him, there are many.
                          Great book! And I think it should be mandatory reading for everyone before they're allowed to post anything.
                          I've read some of Campbell and watched his PBS interviews with Bill Moyers. He was very well compensated for his opinions and efforts to promote same.

                          Nevertheless, is a Bible event based on a traditional story accepted as history (myth; e.g., walking on water) consistent with fact or reality (true) just because people choose to believe it despite real world experiences to the contrary? Shouldn't faith-full Christians be navigating the world's waterways on foot and not in boats, ships, or on PWC?

                          Getting back to my question, I ask again: from where, or from whom, did the Christian belief in levitation* originate? Please, focus on the question and refrain from scripture-related circular reasoning or the offering of unsolicited personal beliefs/opinions?


                          * levitation: "To rise or cause to rise into the air and float in apparent defiance of gravity" (Answers.com); "The phenomenon of a person or thing rising into the air by apparently supernatural means" (WordWeb Dictionary); "The act of raising (a body) from the ground [or water] by presumably spiritualistic means" (op. cit.).
                          Again...

                          " Your question is worded wrong. Christians believe in miracles not in levitation.

                          You could say that belief in miracles began with Moses and even before.

                          More specifically... faith begins when the knowledge of God is declared. When Jesus told Peter to come out... at that moment it became possible and only because it was declared to Peter at that moment, for that specific time and for a specific purpose.

                          If I were to take the Tannakh as an example, I would say that when Joshua crossed the river Jordan on and by command of God which caused the waters to recede from the city of Adam (representing the beginning as well as the beginning of sin) unto the Dead Sea (representing the results of sin) - it was for that moment, for that specific time, for a specific purpose on the command of God.

                          We don't believe in "parting waters" - we believe in God." If God commanded to walk across the river Jordan... at that time it becomes possible. After that... cross at your own risk.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

                            Originally posted by kwd111
                            Originally posted by Heterodoxus
                            Originally posted by Metis
                            Originally posted by Deacon777
                            It is just another one of Joseph Campbell's "The Power of Myth" examples, of which according to him, there are many.
                            Great book! And I think it should be mandatory reading for everyone before they're allowed to post anything.
                            I've read some of Campbell and watched his PBS interviews with Bill Moyers. He was very well compensated for his opinions and efforts to promote same.

                            Nevertheless, is a Bible event based on a traditional story accepted as history (myth; e.g., walking on water) consistent with fact or reality (true) just because people choose to believe it despite real world experiences to the contrary? Shouldn't faith-full Christians be navigating the world's waterways on foot and not in boats, ships, or on PWC?

                            Getting back to my question, I ask again: from where, or from whom, did the Christian belief in levitation* originate? Please, focus on the question and refrain from scripture-related circular reasoning or the offering of unsolicited personal beliefs/opinions?


                            * levitation: "To rise or cause to rise into the air and float in apparent defiance of gravity" (Answers.com); "The phenomenon of a person or thing rising into the air by apparently supernatural means" (WordWeb Dictionary); "The act of raising (a body) from the ground [or water] by presumably spiritualistic means" (op. cit.).
                            Again...

                            Your question is worded wrong. Christians believe in miracles not in levitation.
                            *headdesk*

                            The levitation -is- the miracle in question!

                            Now stop dodging, and answer the damn question!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Walking on Water (Matthew 14:28-31)

                              Originally posted by wmdkitty
                              Originally posted by kwd111
                              Originally posted by Heterodoxus
                              Originally posted by Metis
                              Originally posted by Deacon777
                              It is just another one of Joseph Campbell's "The Power of Myth" examples, of which according to him, there are many.
                              Great book! And I think it should be mandatory reading for everyone before they're allowed to post anything.
                              I've read some of Campbell and watched his PBS interviews with Bill Moyers. He was very well compensated for his opinions and efforts to promote same.

                              Nevertheless, is a Bible event based on a traditional story accepted as history (myth; e.g., walking on water) consistent with fact or reality (true) just because people choose to believe it despite real world experiences to the contrary? Shouldn't faith-full Christians be navigating the world's waterways on foot and not in boats, ships, or on PWC?

                              Getting back to my question, I ask again: from where, or from whom, did the Christian belief in levitation* originate? Please, focus on the question and refrain from scripture-related circular reasoning or the offering of unsolicited personal beliefs/opinions?


                              * levitation: "To rise or cause to rise into the air and float in apparent defiance of gravity" (Answers.com); "The phenomenon of a person or thing rising into the air by apparently supernatural means" (WordWeb Dictionary); "The act of raising (a body) from the ground [or water] by presumably spiritualistic means" (op. cit.).
                              Again...

                              Your question is worded wrong. Christians believe in miracles not in levitation.
                              *headdesk*

                              The levitation -is- the miracle in question!

                              Now stop dodging, and answer the damn question!
                              I did... perhaps you didn't read what I said.

                              Comment

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